PRIME MINISTER
Engagements
Q1. Mr. Dunn
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 16 February.
The Prime Minister (Mrs. Margaret Thatcher)
This morning I presided at a meeting of the Cabinet and had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House, I shall be having further meetings later today, including one with the President of Bangladesh.
Mr. Dunn
Is my right hon. Friend aware of the total hostility and opposition of the people of Dartford to British Rail's proposal to build a high speed rail link through north-west Kent concentrating in particular on routes 1 and 2? In case Parliament should give British Rail its private Bill, will my right hon. Friend take the opportunity today to reaffirm the pledges already given by [column 482]Transport Ministers that the Bill will have significant environmental protection and generous compensation for the people who will be affected by the route?
The Prime Minister
I am very well aware that people in Kent are deeply concerned to know what proposal will come forward about extra rail capacity. There is general agreement that there must be increased rail capacity for the people of Kent. Both British Rail and the Government are well aware that a single firm proposal must be brought forward soon. I hope that that will ease the position. I agree that the proposal must take full account of environmental factors and be accompanied by an announcement of proper compensation arrangements.
Mr. Kinnock
Will the Prime Minister tell us how her plans to reach zero inflation are getting along?
The Prime Minister
They are proceeding—[Interruption.]
Mr. Speaker
Order. The Prime Minister has only managed one sentence.
The Prime Minister
—by methods which the right hon. Gentleman opposes. I note that the best performance of the Labour Government was 7.4 per cent. inflation, which was a low level according to their standards, which they reached for only one month. That must be compared with our best performance so far of 2.4 per cent. We have already had inflation at 3 per cent. or below for six months. The chances of our getting down to zero are good.
Mr. Kinnock
The Prime Minister knows that under this Government there has been no oil price hike, no major rise in commodity prices—[Interruption.] So can the Prime Minister tell us why it is that under her Government the rate of inflation is now higher and rising faster in Britain than in any comparable industrialised country?
The Prime Minister
Under this Government there is no incomes and prices policy to keep incomes down and put prices up, as happened under the Labour Government. There have been far fewer strikes, a far better standard of living, far better manufacturing output and far better profitability—better all round.
Mr. Lawrence
Is my right hon. Friend aware of the blistering attack yesterday by the Lord Chief Justice of England on the Government's Green Papers for law reform? Is she further aware that the result of those Green Papers will be the virtual abolition of the independent Bar, which will drive up legal costs—[Interruption.] The Green Papers will restrict the availability of lawyers, particularly in country areas, and will reduce the quality of services. Is my right hon. Friend further aware that those recommendations are directly contrary to the proposals of the Benson Royal Commission in 1979, which the Government accepted in 1983——
Mr. Speaker
Order. Will the hon. and learned Gentleman make it brief?
Mr. Lawrence
What has happened to cause the Government to stand on their head? [Interruption.]
The Prime Minister
I think that I heard half that question. I must point out to my hon. and learned Friend that any proposal, or set of proposals, put forward by our most distinguished Lord MackayLord Chancellor is worthy of serious consideration and merits serious debate. I know that my [column 483]hon. and learned Friend has strong views, and I think that strong views will also be expressed by those who oppose his point of view when we debate this very important subject.
Q2. Mr. Leighton
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 16 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Leighton
How many Cabinet Ministers has the right hon. Lady sacked since she became Prime Minister? Was there any pattern in their behaviour that might enable us to forecast who will be next?
The Prime Minister
Really. How very ungentlemanly of the hon. Gentleman. Cabinet Ministers resign from time to time.
Q3. Mr. John Marshall
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 16 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Marshall
Does my right hon. Friend agree that to suggest that we should maintain the independent deterrent, but then to say that there are no circumstances in which it would be used, undermines its credibility? Does she agree that the authors of the proposal are interested not in the peace of the world but in creating an uneasy peace within their own party?
The Prime Minister
Yes, I agree fully with my hon. Friend. Any such suggestion betrays a total lack of understanding of nuclear deterrence, which has been the basis of NATO strategy and has kept the peace for 40 years. The proposal betrays a fundamental weakness in defence policy. This Government will maintain our defences to ensure that the defence of freedom is strong.
Q4. Mr. Tony Banks
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 16 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Banks
May I congratulate the Prime Minister on the excellent news that she is soon to become a grandmother?
Dame Peggy Fenner
That is more than the hon. Gentleman will ever manage.
Mr. Banks
Everything is possible in this life. When her hard-working son once more graces these shores with a shiny new——
Mr. Speaker
Order. These are not matters for the Prime Minister.
Mr. Banks
Her son must be a matter for the Prime Minister.
Mr. Speaker
The hon. Gentleman must ask a parliamentary and not a family question.
Mr. Banks
When her son returns to these shores——
Mr. Speaker
Order. Questions to the Prime Minister must relate to her parliamentary responsibilities.
[column 484]Q5. Mr. Churchill
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 16 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Churchill
Now that the last Soviet soldier has left Afghanistan, will my right hon. Friend pay tribute to the courage and sacrifice of the Afghan people over more than nine years of occupation? Will she also express our appreciation to President Gorbachev for the new-found realism in Soviet foreign policy? Does that not make possible the opening of a new and more productive chapter in the relationship between our two countries?
The Prime Minister
Yes, I agree with my hon. Friend that it has been the superb courage and determination of the resistance which have meant that the occupying forces have now left Afghanistan. That is good for Afghanistan and good news for the world as a whole. We should also pay tribute to the role of Pakistan in receiving many refugees over the years and in looking after them so unselfishly. I shall certainly convey our appreciation to Mr. Gorbachev, when he comes in April. This is a new chapter and indicates a new realism. We hope that it can be used also to solve other regional problems.
Dr. Owen
As less than half of Conservative voters think that the National Health Service is safe in the hands of this Government and one third of them think that it is unsafe, is it not time that the Government withdrew the proposals to commercialise the Health Service, to introduce an open, not an internal, market and to create a two-tier Health Service?
The Prime Minister
The right hon. Gentleman knows full well that there are no proposals to privatise the National Health Service; nor could there be any such proposals because one does not pay for the service at the point of use; nor should one. The National Health Service is a great deal safer in the hands of a Conservative Government than it ever was in the right hon. Gentleman's hands when he was Minister of State for Health and than it ever was in Labour hands, when they spent only a fraction on the Health Service of what the British taxpayer is spending now.
Q6. Mr. Couchman
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 16 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Couchman
Can my right hon. Friend confirm that when she met the Israeli Foreign Minister, Mr. Arens, she made it clear that there can be no peaceful settlement to the middle eastern conflict without acceptance of the principle of territory for peace?
The Prime Minister
Yes, we had a very fruitful discussion yesterday with the Israeli Foreign Minister and we made it absolutely clear that when the Arab world is negotiating, it will be territory in return for peace. That is, of course, the basis of United Nations resolution 242, which Israel accepts.
Mr. Ashley
I welcome the Prime Minister's condemnation of the sale of kidneys, but can she tell the House which she finds more abhorrent—the sale of those organs or the [column 485]debt and poverty that induce people to sell them? Now that the British people have begun to sell organs, can the Prime Minister tell the House what she feels about the fact that more than 3 million people in Britain are in debt and more than 6 million people are living in poverty—as I hope she acknowledges? That record is the shameful and shabby result of her policies.
The Prime Minister
I made my views known on the sale of kidneys. I think that it is utterly abhorrent and even though people are poor, it does no mean that they should forfeit all the respect to which they are entitled. The right hon. Gentleman referred to poverty. Poverty, on his definition, is constantly upgraded, as far as income is concerned. In fact, there are fewer pensioners now in the bottom one fifth of income than there were under the Government that he supported.
Q7. Mr. John Greenway
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 16 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Greenway
Does my right hon. Friend agree that today's confirmation that unemployment has fallen below 2 million is a significant landmark in the Government's campaign to create more jobs? Is it not also significant that unemployment is falling throughout the country and that the number of job vacancies, including in the north of England, is rising?
The Prime Minister
Yes. Today's news that unemployment has fallen—seasonally adjusted—to below 2 million was very good news. Not only has unemployment fallen, but there are now more people in employment in this country than at any time ever, and that, too, is excellent news. There has been a particularly good record since the last election. During the last election [column 486]campaign the Labour party promised that it would create 1 million jobs in two years. They would have done that by methods that would have undermined the economy, whereas we have created very nearly 1 million new jobs in under two years by methods which have reinforced our prosperity.
Q8. Mr. Nellist
To ask the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 16 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend—[Interruption.]—or the hon. Gentleman or hon. Lady, whichever it is, to the answer that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Nellist
During the Prime Minister's discussions with the Israeli Foreign Minister Moshe Ahrens, has she raised with him the fact that in four days last month in the occupied territories eight children, one as young as 11, were killed by rubber or plastic-coated steel bullets—some shot at close range in the head or chest? How are the Government of Israel to be censured, other than by sharp, economic direct action—if not by the Government, by the workers of this country?
The Prime Minister
We have made our views about some of the events in the West Bank very clear to Israel. The hon. Gentleman points out—it underlies his remarks—that there is a need to get negotiations going and that they need to be properly prepared on the basis of United Nations resolution 242, which deals with territory for peace. I firmly believe that the overwhelming majority of people in Israel seek a maintained peace with security behind their own border. That is also the purpose and wish of the Arabs in the region.
Mr. Tony Banks
On a point of order, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker
Order. I shall take points of order after business questions.