Speeches, etc.

Margaret Thatcher

Radio Interview for IRN (Brussels European Council)

Document type: Speeches, interviews, etc.
Venue: Charlemagne Building, Brussels
Source: Thatcher Archive: COI transcript
Journalist: John Fraser, IRN
Editorial comments: Late evening, after the press conference which began at 2144. MT took off for London at 2330.
Importance ranking: Major
Word count: 1021
Themes: Agriculture, Trade, European Union (general), European Union Budget, Foreign policy (development, aid, etc), Science & technology

John Fraser, IRN

Prime Minister, eleven other Common Market Governments were able to reach a broad agreement on the reform of the Common Market, but you weren't. What was the problem you encountered? What was your biggest obstacle?

Prime Minister

Well, there is nothing unusual in that is there? We were going through a document in great detail and all of a sudden one or two of them lifted up and said “I could agree with this whole document” , one or two others said “I can” and I said “No, we do not do things like that in Britain, what I want to do is go through all of the small print because I am committing by country, it is taxpayers and it is people and I am not prepared to agree this without full and proper discussion,” and as it were, the two things on which we had major disagreements were two things on which were not properly discussed at all.

John Fraser, IRN

Nonetheless Prime Minister, it is being suggested that your very approach to this is very different to that of the other Common Market leaders. I believe that over dinner on Monday night the French Prime Minister Jacques Chirac accused you of having a [end p1] housewife's approach to the whole issue. Did you find that offensive?

Prime Minister

Good housekeeping is not a bad discription of what I try to do whether at home or in the nation's finances as a result of which Britain is in no trouble over a deficit and its economy is growing well; yes, I do plead guilty to good housekeeping, whether it be at home or in the nation's finances.

John Fraser, IRN

Obviously there are problems still to be solved. What will happen at the eleventh hour when Common Market leaders come back to this problem? Under what circumstances will you agree to pour more money into the bath of the Common Market as you have called it—you have called it a “bath without a plug” ?

Prime Minister

Under the circumstances which I have already set out—you see we have been here twice before—every time when we have had to put up the amount which the British taxpayer contributes I have said, “Look, we have got to get some discipline into the way this money is used, you cannot just say every time you have got a problem, throw more money at it and spend more, because it is my taxpayers who are having to put it in, German taxpayers, ours and now the French, a good deal less than we do, and so if we are going to put in more resources and you say you need them, then we have got to get control over what you spend and how you spend and we have got [end p2] to agree on the kind of budget you have and it has got to be legally binding and this is because you said before you would get discipline in your spending; you did not, you breached that trust and this time we have got to get it legally enforcible.”

John Fraser, IRN

Could I ask you about proposed Common Market tax on vegetable oil and fats which would put up the price of margarine? I believe that you fought very hard against this, were you successful?

Prime Minister

I fought extremely hard against it and so did a number of other colleagues, indeed we have what is called a blocking minority—indeed I think there were a lot of us against it; against it because it would give a lead to the world that we are going in for protectionist policies and if we do that then the consequences for retaliation for us would be enormous and secondly, many of the Third World countries export oils and fats to us and they have been bombarding us with protests about it—it is no earthly good saying you want to help the Third World and then stopping them from selling the only thing they have got to you, and thirdly, it would put up the price to the housewife in this country. A 32 pence package of margarine would go up by 10 pence—that is a lot—about 30%;! and also the price of some cooking oil would go up similarly and I just said to them, “Is there no-one else in this room who actually is prepared to look after the interests of the housewife because I am not prepared to agree to that sort of increase?” [end p3]

John Fraser, IRN

Finally, Prime Minister, the Common Market leaders have been discussing a very important research programme which until now Britain has been very cautious about; it has been suggested that because of Britain's blocking, scientists were being thrown out of work, research into AIDS and cancer was being held up, do you have any good news on this?

Prime Minister

What has been happening is that the Community at the moment is broke. We are overspent. As Mr Delors would say, we are virtually bankrupt. Now when you are virtually bankrupt you do not embark on extra expenditure; you try in fact to meet your debts first and what the Commission was doing and other people were doing was to say, “Nevertheless, although we are nearly broke we can go on with increased research and development expenditure,” and I said, “No, you cannot until we have got our finances sorted out” . However there was a problem this year and next because without releasing some money and making it clear it was available then some programmes might have been in difficulty so I said, “Look, the money in the budget for this year and the money we have got in the budget for next—that is safe, let us agree that that should be used and let us agree on the content of the programme,” and that I think has sorted the problem out for the time being.

John Fraser, IRN

So there will be some money for research? [end p4]

Prime Minister

Oh yes, there is money in this year's programme. We also have money in next year's programme which we have allocated and the Community has allocated, but there was a procedural point that you have to agree the total programme to which it relates. Now I was not prepared to agree the total money because it is over and above what we can afford at the moment until we have got things sorted out. I said “Right, we agree the content of the programme and the speed at which we go at it and next” .