Albert Lee, Channel 4
Hello Mrs Thatcher. How do your jobs as a Prime Minister and a mother compare?
MT
Well, I couldn't really do a job as Prime Minister if my children were young. In this country it takes quite a long time to get to be a Prime Minister. You see I first went into Parliament when … in 1959. So I had been in there, what, twenty eight years, and I just don't think I could have concentrated on the greater responsibilities if my children were still young.
They have some things in common. Let me make this quite clear. At home, you have to learn to live within the money you've got. You have to learn to budget. So you do with governments. And if you don't budget, if you borrow too much, you get into trouble, the country gets into trouble. And if you borrowed too much at home the family would soon be in financial difficulties. And you know people really try to poke fun at this rather simple straightforward belief of mine. They don't poke fun now. We've never got into difficulty from over-borrowing because I from the things which I learned at home and in a small business, say “No, you have to live within your means” .
Albert Lee, Channel 4
Do you think it is harder for a woman to go into politics?
MT
I think it is harder. It is certainly harder for a woman with a young family because people would say “but you can't leave your home” . I was lucky. My home was in London, the constituency I represent is in Greater London, and so when my children were six I was able to think, “well, I'll try and go for Parliament” , and I did and successfully. But I was always at home every evening.
Jamie de la Marr, Channel 4
What are you doing for women? How are you helping them?
MT
Well, we believe that women help themselves and we are trying to get more and more opportunities for them. And we have legislation which makes discrimination against women for jobs illegal. But you know women are coming up and up and they are taking a much greater part in many of the professions that we used to. But we still have the same problem you do, not enough women coming into politics,
Albert Lee, Channel 4
Mrs Thatcher, you've been in power for as long as I can remember. [end p1]
MT
Oh, isn't that nice? That's lovely. [children giggle] I've been Prime Minister for eight years.
Albert Lee, Channel 4
How do other countries view Great Britain?
MT
I think at the moment they view Great Britain as having overcome many of her problems. We used to be called “the sick man of Europe” . We are not called that any more.
Jamie de la Marr, Channel 4
How do you perceive yourself, and how do you think other people perceive you?
MT
Oh, goodness me. Ah, I have really no idea. Ahm, there are things called images these days. What puzzles me is that sometimes one's image can get so different from the kind of person one is. Ahm, but I think it is for other people to say how they perceive one. I just try to … be the same person.
Jamie de la Marr, Channel 4
If you had more money for children in Great Britain, what would you spend it on?
MT
More money? I think most of us are very worried in this country by some things which happens to some children. [sic] Some are neglected, some are cruelly treated, and I think that that is the very worst thing which we have to face.
Albert Lee, Channel 4
What are you doing to stop these problems?
MT
Well, we have more police. We have social workers. We have something called Neighbourhood Watches. But it is not a thing which needs the help of government only. But we do say to people “look, the life of children is so precious that if you see or hear something which makes you think a child is being badly treated, then please let us know” .
Jamie de la Marr, Channel 4
And what happens to children, if something does happen to them?
MT
They are taken away from the people who are ill-treating them. They might go to what's called a foster-mother, or they might go into a home which is run by social workers to look after these children.
Jamie de la Marr, Channel 4
What happens to children who are born into poverty? [end p2]
MT
We have something rather different from anything that you have. We have something run by government which is called a “supplementary benefit system” . And so if you have no income then in fact you are able to get a house and housing benefit is paid for you and so everyone gets an income up to a certain level, on condition they are available to do a job if one should come up.
Albert Lee, Channel 4
And how do you deal with troubled kids who turn to crime, or who are homeless?
MT
It is a very great worry. If they are homeless they will come into care to be looked after by the local authority. But crime is a great worry because the peak age for criminal offences is the age of fifteen. In the end you know, it is to the person concerned whether they take to crime or whether they don't. And what government has to do is to say “look, we can't make you be kind, considerate to one another. We can't make you good by legislation” . And what we can do is to say, “if you commit offences against your fellow citizens, against your fellow children, we will have quite tough sentences” . It is a kind of world in which you should do as you would be done by.
Albert Lee, Channel 4
And what problems are there in the educational system?
MT
We are not very satisfied with our educational system, because we were finding that some of our children weren't coming out of school sufficiently able to read and write well enough, and sufficiently well versed in ordinary arithmetic, mathematics and in wider general knowledge.
Albert Lee, Channel 4
And if everything happened as it should?
MT
Then far many more young people would come out of school knowing certain basic things—about language, about mathematics, certain basic things about science, certain basic things about geography and history, so they should really know how their lives fit into the background and really what kind of challenges which they have to take forward into the future.
Jamie de la Marr, Channel 4
It has been said that you have got everything that you set out to get. What are your priorities from here?
MT
Got everything I set out to get? Well, what are my priorities? Well, first a government has to be able to have a sure defence policy, so that one's friends and allies know one is a reliable ally and a trusted friend. Secondly, it is really to give bigger and bigger [end p3] opportunities to people who haven't had them and to enable more and more people to become what you would call “the people's capitalism” . [sic] If you have some talent, some ability, if you want something a little different, it is up to us as a government to enable you have a wider and larger choice, because that is what freedom is all about.
Film of interview ends. Back to studio, with interviewers being questioned on their experience of the interview
Programme Host, Channel 4
So, Jamie, what did you expect from the Prime Minister, and what did you get?
Jamie de la Marr
I think that she was a good interviewee. She answered what she wanted to say. I mean if there was something that she didn't want you to know then she didn't say it! Laughter.
Albert Lee
Well, I asked her about, um, about some kids who … what Great Britain does about kids who get into crime. She seemed not really to say too much about that. She seemed to talk more about crime in general.
Jamie de la Marr
In some ways maybe she should care more about women's issues. I don't think that she really does.
Albert Lee
I was trying to find out, since she's been around so long, will people, do people still want her? She basically pretty much avoided it.
Jamie de la Marr
She says she cares. I don't know if she does [laughter] because it seems like children … the same problems here as they do there …
tape ends