PRIME MINISTER
(Engagements)
Q1. Mr. Roger King
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 5 February.
The Prime Minister (Mrs. Margaret Thatcher)
This morning I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House I shall be having further meetings later today.
Mr. King
As, so far today, another 600 mineworkers have gone back to work, and as the overwhelming view of the House last night was that a negotiated settlement on the basis of uneconomic pit closures had to be reached, can my right hon. Friend confirm that the NACODS agreement is still there for the National Union of Mineworkers to pick up? If the NUM has trouble arriving at an agenda agreeable to it in which the closure of uneconomic pits is item No. 1, can my right hon. Friend use her good offices to make it item No. 2, with “apologies” as item No. 1?
The Prime Minister
I confirm what was said last night. As I have frequently said to the Leader of the Opposition, the strike would be over if the NUM accepted the NACODS agreement and the NACODS approach. I believe that the National Coal Board was right to make the fundamental issue of this strike—the closure of pits on uneconomic grounds—item No. 1 in the agenda. If the NUM would agree to the wording for item No. 1 sent to it by the NCB, negotiations could start.
Mr. Steel
Will the Prime Minister find time today to send a message of congratulations, on behalf of the whole House, to the Archbishop of Canterbury on the success of his envoy through the patient diplomacy in Libya?
The Prime Minister
I gladly join the right hon. Gentleman, the Leader of the Liberal party. The Libyan decision to release the four hostages into Mr. Waite 's custody is a welcome development. We are deeply grateful to His Grace Robert Runciethe Archbishop of Canterbury and to Mr. [column 742]Waite for the patience and skill that they have shown in the past few months. We now look to the Libyan authorities to complete quickly the formalities for the early return of the four people to their families in Britain.
Mr. Chris Smith
Does the Prime Minister recall that last Thursday she told me on the Floor of the House that she had never predicted that unemployment would start to fall? Does she also recall that in November 1983 she said on the Floor of the House that she hoped to see a “reduction” in unemployment in the coming months? Does she also recall that in December 1983, she said: “Unemployment … appears to have peaked” ?—[Official Report, 8 December 1983; Vol. 50, c. 461.] Will she now be more honest with the House and tell us that unemployment is remorselessly rising? Will she show any remorse for the part that her Government's policies have played in that?
The Prime Minister
The hon. Gentleman has struggled to find quotations and has been wholly unable to find one that predicted the state of unemployment and gave figures either for the end of a year or for the future. The hon. Gentleman astonishes me. Yes, I do hope that unemployment will fall. I hope that the hon. Gentleman hopes so too.
Q2. Mr. Neale
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 5 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Neale
Has my right hon. Friend noted that retail spending in December was the highest on record in terms of both value and volume? Does she agree that one of the best ways to create more home-based jobs would be to meet that increased demand with home-produced products and services which are both enterprising and competitive, rather than to surrender a substantial part of that demand to our overseas competitors?
The Prime Minister
Yes, retail sales were very high indeed. It shows that there is no shortage of overall demand. I hope that more and more people will buy British goods because they are the best and I hope that more and more manufacturers will realise that the components that they buy can be manufactured just as well in Britain and upon as competitive a basis.
Mr. Kinnock
After another year in which industrial production was down, the pound was down and the trade balance was down, while manufactured imports were up by 10 per cent., interest rates were up by 15 per cent. and the unemployment rate was up by 150,000, was the Chancellor of the Exchequer correctly conveying the Prime Minister's view when he said last night that the Government's strategy “has achieved what it set out to achieve” ?
The Prime Minister
The Government's strategy has achieved the lowest inflation for 15 or 16 years, which is absolutely vital, the highest output, which is absolutely vital, and record investment. On top of all that we have honoured our pledges to the pensioners and have achieved a 20 per cent. real increase in the National Health Service. That is far better than the record of the right hon. Gentleman's party.
Mr. Kinnock
We are used to hearing the Prime Minister's tales of recovery. [column 743]
“To be told that we are in the fourth year of recovery with unemployment at 3½ million is a definition of an economic boom unknown to me.”
Those are the words of the Conservative Member of Parliament for Bury, North (Mr. Burt) in the current edition of Reformer, the journal of the Tory Reform Group. Its president is the right hon. Member for Worcester (Mr. Walker). Does the Prime Minister not realise that businesses and managers all over the country take the same view of affairs as her hon. Friend and that her policies and strategies are not an achievement but an act of economic sabotage on a grand scale?
The Prime Minister
If the right hon. Gentleman thinks that, he must apply exactly the same strictures to the German economy, which announced today record unemployment of something like 10.4 per cent. Germany also has conscription. It has also sent home a number of its gastarbeiter. What the right hon. Gentleman is refusing to do is to recognise that we are in a technological age and can turn out manufactured goods with far fewer people, and that therefore we have to aim for more employment in the service industries, which are labour-intensive. But that the right hon. Gentleman refuses to do.
Mr. Kinnock
I am most concerned about the real Britain. The three chairmen of chambers of commerce, the Northumbrian branch of the British Institute of Management, the northern region of the Confederation of British Industry and the north-east branch of the Institute of Directors yesterday asked the Prime Minister in The Times to engage in a programme of public works. They dismissed the idea of income tax cuts as a way to promote recovery and asked the Prime Minister to do something now to bring down unemployment. The hon. Friends of the Prime Minister are telling her that, business men and managers are telling her that, we are telling her that. Why does not the Prime Minister listen and learn and change her policies?
The Prime Minister
If the right hon. Gentleman were to look at the CBI forecast he would find that it is optimistic and confident and that both industry and trade, as my hon. Friend the Member for Cornwall, North (Mr. Neale) said—with record sales, record output, record investment and rising profits—are well pleased.
Q3. Mr. Tim Smith
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 5 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Smith
What reassurance can my right hon. Friend give to my constituents on airports policy following last week's debate? Can she confirm that it remains Government policy not to build a fifth terminal at Heathrow and to introduce the 275,000 air traffic movements limit when the fourth terminal is opened later this year?
The Prime Minister
I realise that my hon. Friend has a constituency interest in this, but I am sure he will understand that it would be best for me to make no further comment whatever until the Government have considered everything that has been said and decided what policy to bring before the House for its approval.
Q4. Mr. Frank Cook
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 5 February.
[column 744]The Prime Minister
I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Cook
Will the Prime Minister afford the Chamber some time this afternoon to explain how it is that Sarah Tisdall could be subjected to Government-inspired charges for circulating a somewhat unclassified document, while much more senior officials are to be allowed to give evidence to the Australian Royal Commission on nuclear testing and yet be exempted from perjury? Will she explain how one person can be imprisoned for telling the truth while others can be let off scot-free for telling lies under oath? Will she explain whether, when she refers to law and order, she is referring to her law and order or Parliament's?
The Prime Minister
I do not accept the premise in the hon. Gentleman's question. Prosecutions are not a matter for Her Majesty's Government, as the hon. Gentleman knows full well. I hope that the hon. Gentleman will think it right that we should give every assistance possible to the Australian commission of inquiry. That is what we are doing.
Q5. Mr. Fox
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 5 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Fox
Will my right hon. Friend accept that, following the opening of the border between Gibraltar and Spain, a cloud hung over the ceremony—the issue of sovereignty? Will she take the opportunity today to reassure our friends in Gibraltar that their views on that issue will be paramount?
The Prime Minister
I believe that the opening of the border between Gibraltar and Spain today was generally welcomed, but I understand the purpose of my hon. Friend's question. Let me make it clear that the statement of 27 November 1984 underlined Her Majesty's Government's intention fully to maintain their commitment to honour the freely and democratically expressed wishes of the people of Gibraltar, as set out in the preamble to the Gibraltar constitution of 1969. As my hon. Friend says, Her Majesty's Government have given assurances to the people of Gibraltar that Gibraltar will remain part of Her Majesty's dominions unless and until an Act of Parliament provides otherwise, and, furthermore, that Her Majesty's Government will never enter into arrangements under which the people of Gibraltar would pass under the sovereignty of another state against their freely and democratically expressed wishes. [Interruption.] The Opposition may not take much notice of that; we cherish the freedom of the people of Gibraltar to decide their future.
Q6. Mr. Hardy
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 5 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Hardy
Will the right hon. Lady agree that since she took office as Prime Minister her Government have received £50,000 million in revenue from offshore activity? What has the country to show for it?
The Prime Minister
If the hon. Gentleman had listened to the economic debate that we had the other day [column 745]he would have heard the point made—I thought effectively—that when we no longer have the North sea oil assets it will be vital to have replaced them by other income-producing assets. When we came to power we had £15 billion worth of assets overseas. We now have £70 billion worth, sufficient to give us a goodly income now and in future years.
Q7. Mr. Heddle
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 5 February.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Heddle
Will my right hon. Friend take time today to consider the position of local councils which have lent [column 746]on mortgage £4,000 million over 15, 20 or 25 years? Would it not be better if those local councils made that money available to building societies and other financial institutions and so re-invested the money in rehabilitation, modernisation and improvement of the 23,500 houses which they have left empty for more than 12 months?
The Prime Minister
Yes, I believe that my hon. Friend is right. I notice that he has tabled a question to Nigel Lawsonthe Chancellor of the Exchequer about some of the complexities of what would emerge from such a policy, and I shall leave my right hon. Friend to answer that in fuller detail.