Speeches, etc.

Margaret Thatcher

TV Interview for BBC (Maastricht European Council)

Document type: Speeches, interviews, etc.
Venue: Maastricht
Source: Thatcher Archive: COI transcript
Journalist: John Humphrys, BBC
Editorial comments:

No press conference has been traced; MT may only have had time for interviews after the Maastricht Council.

Importance ranking: Major
Word count: 1181
Themes: Agriculture, European Union (general), Northern Ireland, British relations with France, British relations with Italy, British relations with Netherlands, British relations with the Federal Republic of Germany

Interviewer

The same ground I regret to say as Trevor MacDonald for ITN and it is the usual bit for the nine o'clock news and a bit longer, I hope, for the news item. There is obviously no point in talking to you for instance about the Hollis affair. Mrs. Thatcher, it does look as though Britain is in the dog-house in the Common Market again with France and Germany ranged against us over the fish issue. Do you reconcile interests of Britain with the wider interests of the Common Market?

Prime Minister

Well, the particular issue this time was that some countries wanted agreements between the Community and third countries on fishing, like Canada, the Faroes, to go ahead in the absence of a Common Fisheries Policy. Now if they were to do that then they had to agree to take a lot of fish off our markets in Britain. Because you know what is happening at the moment, we are having a tremendous amount of imported fish already at such prices that it is not worth our fishermen fishing. So we said if you do want to go ahead with those third country policies you've got to agree to take a lot of fish off our market and our fishermen are not disadvantaged. They wouldn't. Those talks were concluded last Friday and they would just not agree what was necessary for us so therefore we had to say, all right, no agreement with third countries except against a background of a Common Fisheries Policy which in fact fully safeguards the interests of our fishermen. So that's the position which we returned and we took the initiative and said it's very urgent, for years and years we've been discussing it and we haven't got one. We should have had one by last December. We have nearly got it, nearly got it. Now we just better get together and almost conclude the negotiations of last December so that the fishermen of many, many local communities in many countries can have an agreement upon which their future is safe and upon which they can rely.

Interviewer

And in the meantime you are coming under great pressure. You have been coming under great pressure to make concessions. [end p1]

Prime Minister

But it is no earthly good putting pressure on me. The greatest pressure on me is Britain's interests. It is no earthly good in putting pressure on me contrary to that.

Interviewer

But they tried - some of your colleagues. How rough a meeting was that?

Prime Minister

I wouldn't say it was rough, one was just very firm, very firm. You said no.

Interviewer

And their reaction to that?

Prime Minister

Well, their reaction to that was that they then agreed that we should call all the Fisheries Ministers together. They can do the details. We want a Common Fisheries Policy. And we so very nearly got it in December. It is a great pity with those negotiations that were suddenly broken off, not through any fault of our own.

Interviewer

But, as you said, they were broken off by the French. The French were responsible for that. The French appeared to want you to make more concessions. Can you reach an agreement, without making more concessions?

Prime Minister

It is not a question of concessions. We've reached agreement there on quotas, actually reached agreement on what quota each country should have. Now it is a question of enabling each country to fish to that quota and that is why we have very nearly reached agreement.

Interviewer

But what about access? The French demanding more access to British fishing waters than we are prepared to give them. They are still insisting on that it seems.

Prime Minister

Well, they have their quota and we have our quota and those quotas are agreed and the thing is to make arrangements that will give each of us the full capacity to fish right up to our quota. [end p2]

Interviewer

I wonder what you might be able to say to the British fishermen who might feel they are in the process of being sold out. That there might be some danger of being sold out.

PM

A few moments ago you were saying that I was very intransigent in not agreeing to what Herr Chancellor Schmidt and President Giscard and Mr. Jorgensen wanted. I would not agree because I would not sell out our fishermen. Any arrangement we make must be against the background of a Common Fisheries Policy and we have taken the fishing industry with us all the way. You can be absolutely certain that Mr. Walker and Mr. Buchanan-Smith will continue to do that.

Interviewer

What if this was at the expense of a new fishing agreement? What if you cannot reach a new fishing agreement on that basis? What damage does that do?

PM

We shall go on and on trying to reach a new fisheries agreement and we must reach one because it is disadvantaging all of the fishermen in the Community.

Interviewer

Can I ask you about your meeting with Mr. Haughey, the Irish Prime Minister? What was the subject?

PM

It was not so much an official meeting. We had talks with a number of Heads of Government in the margins of a Council such as this. As you know from the statement we issued yesterday we were very very distressed and disconcerted about the report in the Guardian which referred to another interview which seemed to put things in a light totally different from anything that we had ever agreed.

Interviewer

Are you concerned that the interview … Are you concerned that that report in the newspaper is likely to undermine the confidence of people?

PM

We have made a statement putting the position absolutely where we believe it always to be and where we still believe it to be and as it is understood between Heads of Government. [end p3]

Interviewer

Has it caused a rift in any way between you and the Irish Government?

PM

It causes me very great concern.

Interviewer

But is the situation between you and Mr. Haughey changed in any way?

PM

It hasn't caused a rift. It has caused very great concern, such concern but we have made our views known in no uncertain way. &dubellip;

Interviewer

And how did Mr. Haughey react to that?

PM

I think Charles Haugheyhe knew that I was very concerned indeed.

Interviewer

Did he share you concern?

PM

Mr Haughey agrees, I think, with the interpretation we have always put upon those talks. They are not to discuss constitutional matters. They are talks between the United Kingdom and the Republic of Ireland and we both agree that that is what they are all about and have constantly said so.

Interviewer

Prime Minister, thank you very much.