Interviewer
Prime Minister, you have commented in general on the achievements of your ten years, what you see as people being better off and Britain having a higher standing internationally. I wonder if I could ask you what are the single moments that you are proudest of in your ten years as national leader?
Prime Minister
It is not so much the single moments that you are proudest of that you remember, it is the moments that you are most worried about which was of course the Falklands because hour after hour one was worried, it was the difficulty of making the decision to use the United States bases for Libya. It is when you hear of a terrible tragedy, time after time, and when you go and see people each and every person we all react the same to tragedy. You do not know the depth of it until you have to experience it. [end p1]
In a strange way, the joyous times do not etch so deeply on your mind as the difficult times, although it is the joyous times that keep you going.
Interviewer
People well of course remember the way that you have responded to tragedies. Have you ever had second thoughts when you have been accused of ambulance-chasing by some people?
Prime Minister
No I have not. I just think anyone who says that must be a pretty sour person and I do not take any notice because I know I want to go and see the people and I think they appreciate it. One person was quite upset that I had not been earlier. When we had the Liverpool tragedy I went to the hospital the next day, that is after they have done their initial medical treatment and so we are not hindering anything and I went to both hospitals. And then I did not go up to Liverpool itself until the Memorial Service and someone really took quite the other view and said they thought it would have been better if I had also gone to Liverpool before. But at least that meant that the visits were wanted, which was what I was really most anxious to hear. [end p2]
Interviewer
Of course that is the sort of criticism which you do expose yourself to?
Prime Minister
You expose yourself to criticism whatever you do because in politics of course you have many enemies. But you cannot let life be determined by your enemies, you have to let it be determined by what you feel you should do.
Interviewer
One moment where you were very heavily criticised was during Westland, is it true that at that point you suggested that you thought you might not be Prime Minister at the end of the day?
Prime Minister
It is just one of those things you know which you toss out and do not really mean. Westland does not leave one of those vivid memories on my mind at all, it was not about really great issues.
Interviewer
You have said today that you want to press on, that you are thinking about the millennium. How do you react to opinion polls which suggest that a lot of people feel they have had enough of Thatcherism and that would even like you to stand down? [end p3]
Prime Minister
Well of course one's political opponents will say things like that. Sometimes I think they are saying it because they think that their chances of getting in might be enhanced if I go.
Interviewer
Opinion polls are not all your political opponents, that is the assessment of national opinion.
Prime Minister
No, no, but the real opinion poll that matters is when they come to look at the whole record at the time of an election. And then on each occasion they have looked, and they have looked at the alternative, and they have returned us.
And I think even now people do realise that we have done quite a lot of things which no other government could have done and that those things have been for the benefit of Britain and her people and often for the benefit of the wider world as well because when I go abroad and they say thank goodness someone stands firm.
Interviewer
But you have been an activist, it has really been a question has it not, of forcing your policies on the people who perhaps are dragging their heels a bit? [end p4]
Prime Minister
I have not forced my policies on anyone, I could not. I try to say what I believe. These are the things which I believe in, these are the policies which stem from them and this is what we should do and this is why.
We try to get the right policies and then we try to persuade. I cannot force my policies on anyone.
Interviewer
Are there things that you would perhaps like to get adopted that you think you could not force?
Prime Minister
I cannot force policies on anyone, we have to persuade. And I learned in my very first year in Parliament, when I myself had a Private Member's Bill, I did not get everything I wanted from that Bill, I learned that sometimes in life you have to get three-quarters of a loaf where you wanted a whole loaf. But if you get three-quarters every time you are not doing badly.
You of course have to take into account that other people may want different things. Party politically that is because they have a totally different philosophy. Our philosophy is that the powers of government should be limited and the freedoms and responsibilities of people enlarged and therefore we must make a framework of law in which freedom can operate. [end p5]
But it is not for Government to dictate to people, it is for Government to serve people and their talents and abilities.
Interviewer
That of course was the slogan behind your medical reforms, your NHS reforms, but they appear to be costing you a great deal politically. Is there going to come a point when you are going to have to change those?
Prime Minister
I do not think that when we have got them into operation, I know exactly what will happen, people will be very pleased. We had this kind of problem when we introduced what was called a limited list on drugs because we said: “Look, it is not the brand name on the packet that makes the drug, it is the chemical within and if it is cheaper to prescribe the actual chemical rather than a more expensive brand name, you will release a lot of money, Government is not going to take that money, it is going into the Health Service”. So we have had it before.
Interviewer
Can you afford to wait for that argument to get across? [end p6]
Prime Minister
Yes I think so, because what bothers me very much is that some people are saying that no doctor should have the choice about whether he manages his own budget. What a terrible attitude to take. On one of the radio polls they discovered that 25 percent of doctors would like to have control over their own budget to manage their own Practice.
Just because other people do not want it should not stop some doctors from having it. That is a terrible attitude. Just because not all hospitals wish to govern themselves, within the Health Service, they should not stop hospitals who already want to do that and they can probably give a better service and anyway they have more responsibility and more right to take decisions.
These things should be enabling. Just because everyone does not want them they have not the right to stop other people.
Interviewer
Finally Prime Minister, could I ask you what you have yet to achieve politically and personally, how many more grandchildren would you want for example?
Prime Minister
One would love more, of course one would, but it was just simply lovely to hold this lovely grandchild, Michael ThatcherMichael, in one's arms for the first time. [end p7]
Of course you want to go on and help the people of the country to do better and to get more opportunity. People will have their own ambitions and they will go on having their own ambitions, usually for their children. They will want to travel more and see more of the world. Most of them want a better environment, most of them want to do more for the community, of which they are a part.
Of course they have their own ambitions and one would like to think that we beautify Britain in all, whether it is in town, country, village, and look after the countryside. We have a lovely country, we must not desecrate it. And most people want to do the things which will enable us to keep a peaceful world. Peace is a very active policy and you have to watch from where so ever danger might come.
All of things are very very important. Always to extend opportunity to young people and encourage them to take advantage of it.
Interviewer
And yet to be achieved?
Prime Minister
There is always more to be achieved and when you have achieved it there will be higher heights to which to climb.