PRIME MINISTER
Engagements
Q1. Mr. Winnick
asked the Prime Minister what are her official engagements for Thursday 17 January.
The Prime Minister (Mrs. Margaret Thatcher)
This morning I presided at a meeting of the Cabinet and had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House I shall be having further meetings later today.
Mr. Winnick
When will the Government act over the suffering and misery of so many elderly people who simply do not have enough money to keep their homes adequately heated during the harsh winter? What sort of Government are they who last November reduced by £1 the heating allowance to the poorest pensioners, who are those between 70 and 85? Does the Prime Minister understand how many of those people have put their health seriously at risk by having insufficient money to keep their homes heated? Can we take it that the Government are concerned only with giving help to the rich and the prosperous?
The Prime Minister
The hon. Gentleman will be aware that the changes in heating allowance enabled it to be given to more pensioners, and that was welcome. I note that the hon. Gentleman is quick to ask questions about heating allowance, but he is equally quick to support a strike deliberately aimed at cutting off heating to old people.
Mr. Rhodes James
I ask my right hon. Friend a question with reference to the proposed commemoration of the 40th anniversary of the ending of the second world war. I remind her that the second world did not end in May 1945 and that tens of thousands of young people from this country and the Commonwealth, including members of my family, served and suffered in the campaign in the far east. If we commemorate the ending of the war, will it be said again that the 14th Army, which was the forgotten army, is to be forgotten once again?
The Prime Minister
We are very much aware of the victory in August 1945 in the war in the far east and of the important and brave part played by so many people in that war. We shall, of course, remember both occasions in the commemorations.
Mr. Kinnock
May I say, first, that I was glad to hear that last answer.
In view of the extremely cold weather—[Interruption.] Conservative Members think that cold is funny. In view of the very cold weather and the promise of worse to come, can the Prime Minister tell us whether she believes that pensioners in all parts of the country should have the same entitlement to severe weather payments? Does she not agree that there is something fundamentally wrong with the system, introduced by the Government in 1981, which forbids giving help to people who are freezing cold this winter simply on the ground that they live in areas which are very cold every winter? In view of the inconsistencies and injustices of the present system, will the Prime Minister give us an undertaking that she will quickly change that system?
The Prime Minister
I cannot give the right hon. Gentleman that undertaking. He will be aware that in [column 507]general heating allowances have gone up far more rapidly than the rate of inflation—something like 40 per cent. more than the increased cost of fuel—so that now some £400 million is spent on heating allowance of which £200 million goes to pensioners, so that is far better than anything previously. In addition, there is provision for single payments on the terms laid down in the order, which sets out a series of objective tests and leaves it to the chief adjudication officer. May I put it to the right hon. Gentleman that if he is really concerned he will tell the striking miners to go back to work so that we can have the future of heating assured, because people are out on strike to prevent heating from getting to old people and to industry.
Mr. Kinnock
Why does not the Prime Minister, just for once, answer the question on the subject raised?
On the subject of severe weather payments, does she not think that it is sensible to understand that bitter cold is bitter cold wherever it is felt, north, south, east or west? When her own Minister for Social Security can refer to the current arrangements as a “weird and wonderful construction” , does she not think that there must be a better system of ensuring that those who have to endure very low temperatures on very low incomes should be helped, wherever they are? Will she please answer that question?
The Prime Minister
The single payments order, as the right hon. Gentleman knows, does give different temperatures. I understand that my right hon. Friend Norman Fowlerthe Secretary of State for Social Services is looking into the matter, but for the time being the objective tests laid down there will continue. I hope that the right hon. Gentleman will now urge the coal miners to go back to work, for it is surely ridiculous to express sympathy but to support a strike deliberately aimed at making it cold for people in houses in bitter weather.
Mrs. Currie
Has my right hon. Friend noticed the allegations that The Observer has been paying large sums of money to encourage Whitehall leaks? Does she agree that leaks of this kind are frequently motivated, not by high-flown, but by misguided ideas of public information; nor, indeed, by baser party political motives, but by the oldest motive of all, greed on the part of both the newspaper and its informants?
The Prime Minister
Whatever the reason for leaks and whichever Government are in power, no Government can carry on effectively unless they can rely on the trust and confidence of those who work in the Civil Service, and in the overwhelming number of cases they can rely upon that trust and confidence.
Mr. J. Enoch Powell
In reflecting upon the commemoration, which has wide public support, of victory in Europe, will the Prime Minister direct her mind to the best way in which, in the framework of that commemoration, there can be a place for the representation of the Russian people, whose sufferings, whose fortitude and whose valour made our own survival and our victory possible?
The Prime Minister
Yes, I shall of course bear that factor in mind. What we are planning is a commemoration in this country, but of course there will be many representatives in the country whom we shall expect, either as high commissioners or as ambassadors, to attend that commemoration.
[column 508]Q2. Mr. Dixon
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 17 January.
The Prime Minister
I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Dixon
Is the right hon. Lady aware that the last shipyard in my constituency closes next month, that the last steel plant in my constituency closes at the end of the year, that the last pit in my constituency closed two years ago, and that one in three men in my constituency are out of work? When she ponders on the VE celebrations, will she bear in mind the fact that her Government's policies between 1979 and 1985 have stopped more industries than Hitler's bombers? What new year's message of hope has she for the 7,852 people in the Jarrow constituency who are out of work?
The Prime Minister
I am aware of what the hon. Gentleman says about the shipyards in his constituency. We naturally appreciate his anxiety about the future of the yards. The Government stand ready to help in the usual way to secure any viable order prospects put forward by British Shipbuilders, but we cannot create orders where they do not exist.
Q3. Mr. Freeman
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 17 January.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Freeman
Is my right hon. Friend aware that two major unions representing the electricians and the engineers have decided to defy the TUC and apply for public cash assistance for secret ballots? Will the Prime Minister encourage other unions to follow that sensible and pragmatic decision?
The Prime Minister
I noticed that decision. It is welcome. The provision is made for people to have postal ballots to enable them more easily to express their democratic views on decisions by officials of their union.
Dr. Owen
If the Prime Minister wishes to give a constitutional safeguard to the people of the Falkland Islands, who are United Kingdom citizens, why does she not use the constitutionally proper form to do so by introducing a Bill in the House, as was done with the Northern Ireland Constitution Act 1973? Does the Prime Minister not recognise that this is a major issue of foreign policy which the House has not discussed, and that that runs counter to the recommendations of the Foreign Affairs Select Committee?
The Prime Minister
I understand that the right hon. Gentleman is talking about the discussions that we are now having with the Falkland Islands Council about its future constitution. The right hon. Gentleman looks angered that we have had them. He would have thought it strange had we made, or attempted to make, any decisions without fully consulting the people who are most deeply interested in their own future. Of course we have been consulting with them. When we have reached a conclusion, details of it will be placed in the Library for hon. Members. When the new constitution and texts are ready, they will be introduced by Orders in Council.—[Hon. Members: “Why?” ] Orders will be made under the British Settlements Act, which provides for such orders then to be laid before Parliament so that they are in accordance with the constitution of the House.
[column 509]Q4. Mr. Geoffrey Robinson
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Thursday 17 January.
The Prime Minister
I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Robinson
Does the Prime Minister recall my intervention in the Chancellor's speech on Tuesday, when I took the liberty to put to him the serious point that the deutschmark was not under threat and that interest rates in Germany had not been raised in panic action similar to that into which her Government have been forced? His reply was that the deutschmark had a lower level of inflation than the pound. Will she come clean with the House and admit that the principal difference is that we are now seen as a one-product economy due to the fact that we have had the devastation of our manufacturing base and a deficit on manufactures in the past year of over £5 billion? Will she come clean with the House and, more importantly, tell us what she is going to do about it?
The Prime Minister
The hon. Gentleman will be aware that oil constitutes about only 5 per cent. of the output of our economy, so no one should judge it a one-product economy. In regard to the deutschmark, I remind him that the Germans have been pursuing policies successfully to keep down inflation for many years and that it is now 2.5 per cent. They have also been pursuing policies to reduce public spending, and have cut their public spending in ways which I do not think would be acceptable to this House. They held up increasing pension provisions and managed to keep down their public sector [column 510]pay for a long time, so much so that they are now able to have tax cuts. As the hon. Gentleman is talking about industry, he should remember that the Germans did not have the degree of restrictive practices and overmanning that we had for years.
Mr. Key
Will my right hon. Friend find time today to take note of the first report of the Historic Buildings and Monuments Commission for England and its important proposals for the development of Stonehenge as a major tourist site, and will she welcome that report?
The Prime Minister
I welcome most reports in that guise. I cannot promise to look at that report today, but I promise to look at it at some time, though not this week.
Mr. Barron
On a point of order, Mr. Speaker——
Mr. Speaker
Does it arise directly out of this question?
Mr. Barron
It arises out of Prime Minister's Question Time, Mr. Speaker, in that questions to the right hon. Lady began a few seconds before 3.17 as the result of a long answer that had previously been given by the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food. May we have 15 minutes of questions to the Prime Minister, and may I ask the right hon. Lady a question about the miners' dispute?
Mr. Speaker
Order. The point to which the hon. Gentleman refers did not take up a full minute; I was watching the clock as carefully as the hon. Gentleman. That is why I called the hon. Member for Salisbury (Mr. Key) to ask a question after 3.30 pm.