PRIME MINISTER
Engagements
Q1. Mr. Winnick
asked the Prime Minister what are her official engagements for 24 January.
The Prime Minister (Mrs. Margaret Thatcher)
This morning I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others, including one with the Secretary General of the OECD. In addition to my duties in the House I shall be having further meetings later today.
Mr. Winnick
Is it not deplorable that the right hon. Member for Down, South (Mr. Powell) should try to bring the Queen into public controversy because of his obsession about the Commonwealth and ethnic minorities? Should not the right hon. Lady strongly criticise his remarks, or is she too busy pandering to the same deplorable prejudices?
The Prime Minister
The Queen makes her Christmas broadcasts as head of the Commonwealth. She does not, therefore, make them on the advice of United Kingdom Ministers. The broadcasts are greatly valued, as a personal message from the Queen at Christmas, in homes throughout Britain and the Commonwealth.
Mr. Farr
When my right hon. Friend met the President of France yesterday, did she take the opportunity to raise with him the deplorable conduct of the French [column 764]workers who hijacked British lorry drivers? Did she seek an assurance that the French Government would do their best to prevent such an incident occurring again?
The Prime Minister
I am sure that my hon. Friend will agree that the President of France took firm action when the incident occurred, and we should be grateful for that.
I discussed mainly three matters with the President. First, we discussed the European Council in Brussels and whether it was possible to reach a settlement on the outstanding matters between the partnerships in the Community. Secondly, we discussed the multinational force in the Lebanon. Thirdly, we discussed East-West matters.
Mr. Donald Stewart
Is the Prime Minister aware of the amazement of many people at the Government's indifference to the appalling shrinkage in the Merchant Navy? If the right hon. Lady is indifferent to the implications of that for employment and trade, will she at least recognise its implications for defence in a maritime nation?
The Prime Minister
It is true that some of our charters and charges have been undercut by other nations. We must be every bit as competitive as they are if we are to continue to gain a good deal of the merchant trade, especially the cross trade. The right hon. Gentleman will be aware that the Government agreed to help British Shipbuilders to replace the Atlantic Conveyor through an order from British yards.
Q2. Mr. Marlow
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for 24 January.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Marlow
Is it not the case that the Inner London education authority was set up by central Government? Therefore, how is it possible for it to lavish large sums of public money on an offensive and distorted propaganda campaign, such as this which I hold in my hand? Will my right hon. Friend ask the district auditor to investigate the matter urgently? While the district auditor is about that, could he find out why it costs twice as much to educate a child in a primary school in London as it costs in Northamptonshire, where the education happens to be a great deal better?
The Prime Minister
The auditors have a duty to look at all spending by local authorities to ensure that it is properly and carefully incurred. Any local elector can make a complaint about a particular item and the auditor is then bound to consider that matter. I agree with my hon. Friend that the education costs of ILEA are, in some respects, about 60 per cent. above those of other authorities.
Mr. Kinnock
On the subject of young people, is the Prime Minister aware that there are now 400,000 unemployed 18 and 19-year-olds in Britain? Not only do they not have work, but they have no education and no training—[Interruption.] The contempt of Conservative Members for unemployed youngsters is always obvious, and it has been added to today. What does the Prime Minister plan to do to help those youngsters to help themselves to get a decent start to their adult life?
[column 765]The Prime Minister
We are making strenuous efforts to ensure that young people, before they reach that age, are properly trained and properly educated. The right hon. Gentleman will be aware of some of the initiatives. He will be aware also of what my right hon. Friend Sir Keith Josephthe Secretary of State for Education and Science did for technical education in schools, which was not carried out during the lifetime of the last Labour Government. He will be aware of the efforts to install computers in schools. He will be aware of the many computer centres established throughout the country for training young people, including those of this age, and he will be aware of the youth training scheme, which ensures that young people, before they get to this age, are properly trained and equipped and therefore have a better chance to secure a job later.
Mr. Kinnock
Many of those stratagems are welcome, but they do not help the 18 and 19-year-olds who do not have jobs, training or education now. If the Prime Minister does not understand the question as it relates to them, and if she does not understand the problem as it relates to them, may I ask her, as a parent, to put herself in the position of a parent of some of these young people and tell us now how she thinks her children could manage on £21.45 a week with no prospect of jobs, education or training? Will she now do something tangible, positive and practical to ensue that this age group is properly attended to?
The Prime Minister
I have indicated some of the fundamental measures that we are taking. With regard to other matters, the right hon. Gentleman is talking about how best to create more genuine jobs in the future. He is very well aware that there is only one way, and that is by producing goods and services that other people will buy, and producing them at a cost that they can afford. That is the way in which the Government will go. That is why we are doing so much to help small businesses and to encourage the formation of new products in the latest technological services.
Sir Hector Monro
Will my right hon. Friend take an opportunity today to pay tribute to those in Scotland, the north of England and elsewhere who are suffering fiendish weather conditions and trying to overcome them? Would she perhaps mention the helicopter crews, the police, the snow plough drivers and the mountain rescue teams, farmers and farm workers, who are doing their very best to overcome dreadful conditions?
The Prime Minister
I gladly respond to my hon. Friend's invitation. I think we all admire the rescue workers who have gone out in these terrible conditions—the helicopter pilots, the police and everyone who has helped—and would like them to know that the House offers its thanks and congratulations to them.
Mr. Beith
Now that the Prime Minister has again failed to secure the support of some of her right hon. and hon. Friends for her local government policies, will she recognise that she has it wrong? Does she recognise that, so far from attacking the vested interest of local government, she is actually enhancing the biggest vested interest of all, central Government bureaucracy? If she wants to stop unrepresentative minorities spending ratepayers' money, why does she not support proportional representation?
[column 766]The Prime Minister
If throughout the rest of my political life in this Parliament, and in the next, I never have a majority below what we had last night, I shall be very satisfied.
Q3. Mr. Tim Smith
asked the Prime Minister if she will list her official engagements for Tuesday 24 January.
The Prime Minister
I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Tim Smith
Is my right hon. Friend aware of the remarks of the Leader of the Opposition on Sunday when he described all those millions of people in work who do not belong to a trade union as scroungers? Does my right hon. Friend agree that this description is bitterly resented by all those hard-working people?
The Prime Minister
Yes, I observed what Neil Kinnockthe right hon. Gentleman said, and I agree with my hon. Friend that such a description would be bitterly resented, because most people believe that they should have the right to choose whether to join a union. Most, indeed the overwhelming majority, of people in Britain are pleased about the legislation that we have passed, which strengthens the right of the individual worker against the trade unions.
Mr. Lofthouse
Will the Prime Minister inform the House whether her son received any financial reward whatsoever for his efforts—and her efforts too—on behalf of the Cementation company?—[Hon. Members: “Cheap.” ] Conservative Members may not want to hear this, but they are going to get it. Did the Prime Minister's son receive any financial reward for his efforts—and her efforts—on behalf of the Cementation company in gaining a contract in Oman? Will she, for the benefit of the country, answer with a straight yes or no?
The Prime Minister
I answer for my public duties from this Dispatch Box. [Hon. Members: “Answer.” ] Members of my family are as much entitled to privacy in going about their private duties as are any other citizens. I refer the hon. Gentleman to what the Select Committee said in 1975:
“A Member of Parliament must expect to be subjected to thorough public scrutiny in the performance of his public duties. He is also, however, a private individual, and is entitled to a proper degree of privacy. His wife and children are equally entitled to such privacy.”
Mr. Jackson
Reverting to my right hon. Friend's visit to Paris yesterday, does she agree that it is welcome to see President Mitterrand at last taking a measure of personal control of the French position in these negotiations? Would she consider it welcome if the French Presidency of the Community succeeded in bringing to the discussions a conclusion by the March European Council?
The Prime Minister
Yes, I agree with my hon. Friend, but there is much to do during the coming weeks and therefore the President is tackling the matter vigorously. It is absolutely vital to us, if there is to be any increase in own resources, that is a fundamentally different way of sharing the burden of the Community budget. It is also extremely important to us that there are strict financial guidelines. Both are important if there is to be a solution in March.
Q4. Mr. Canavan
asked the Prime Minister what are her official engagements for 24 January.
[column 767]The Prime Minister
I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply that I gave some moments ago.
Mr. Canavan
When the Prime Minister casts her vote at the end of the Scott Lithgow debate, will she be batting for Britain or for overseas shipyards? Why is it so difficult to muster the political will and necessary money to intervene here in the renegotiation of a contract when she can find billions of pounds to spend on the Falkland Islands, including a handout of over £7 million for 54 prefabs to a Swedish company, with the possible help and intervention of a former British ambassador?
The Prime Minister
To secure business overseas British shipyards must be as good as any in the world. They must be able to produce their products within budget and on time. Only then will we be able to compete with the rest of the world. The hon. Gentleman will be aware that since nationalisation the taxpayer has paid about £165 million to Scott Lithgow, and during the last year the amount was equal to £13,000 per employee. We must win contracts by being very good and by completing ships and rigs on time.
Mr. John Townend
Is it not a strange world in which the Welsh leader of the Opposition refuses to attend an international at Cardiff Arms park merely because a team of mixed race schoolboys from South Africa is there? Is [column 768]it not even stranger when Ministers at the Welsh Office take the same action? As the Russians have committed far more acts against humanity than have the South Africans, should we not end such double standards and either discourage Russian teams or give notice that we wish to terminate the Gleneagles agreement?
The Prime Minister
I cannot terminate the Gleneagles agreement, to which this country is a party, and which we must uphold. It is a voluntary agreement and we try to see that it is honoured in that spirit. I understand that it was a very good match.
Mr. Sedgemore
Talking about scroungers, may I ask the Prime Minister to tell us whether it was her influence or that of the Cementation company that enabled her son to fly through Oman on a plane owned by the Omani air force—or does she not care to distinguish between grace and favour business deals and grace and favour political deals?
The Prime Minister
I answer for carrying out my public duties, and they are all in the public domain. Members of my family are as much entitled to privacy as those of any other citizen in the United Kingdom. We have not yet reached the stage when parents and their sons have to report everything to the authorities. If it comes to that, 1984 will be here.